Arma 3: Tactical Realism Feedback Thread - Closed

[Sutodoreh.W]

An issue with adding more aviation slots is the oversaturation of air assets for the current number of players on the server. I have hopped on at times to see quite literally half the server slotted as pilots when the ground team consists of not even a squad of players. Adding more pilot slots would make this issue even worse as it would allow more players to slot in as aviation when the ground elements are the ones that need numbers.

Yeah, it's an issue we'll have to monitor but maybe one that we can try handling via S3 controllers and/or MPs instead of by hard-locking slots. The only thing I'm absolutely 100% dead set on is that we need to scrap the Liberation-specific functionality that kicks any non-pilots out of co-pilot slots. Right now, if you land (for example) a raven beside an unconscious person and try to load them in, it'll default load them into the co-pilot slot, then kick them out which means we can't load casualties often. Same problem with door gunner slots on other birds -- casualties get loaded into em and then forced out by file.

 

[Hamm.C]

So, TacR is not an operation, it's an ongoing 24/7 evolution/metamorphosis that is used for numerous purposes. Sure we come here to have fun playing the game but obviously it is our ONLY server to showcase The Cav to public players. Not counting youtube videos which are really just a preview, TacR is our DEMO... and our ONLY demo. We have been increasingly encouraged to pop TacR for this purpose and hopefully as our ultimate recruitment tool. And we are doing it. However, we can't showcase aviation if we don't have sufficient assets available with which to showcase it. Nor could other non-aviation units. Cause and effect: Lock down the slots and we will have people showing up not being able to play, sample or test drive our server's expansive breadth and scope. Now when it comes to "oversaturation" ... you kinda have to think- Are these players having fun doing what they want to do? Are they training? Are they learning? Are they getting stick-time? Are they test-driving our server? I can imagine trying to force people to do what they don't want to do might not be fun for them and likely would result in a pretty quick disconnect. It certainly would for me.

It really just needs to be balanced and currently it is not.

Prior slotting settings have worked just fine which is why I suggested it, but anything would likely be better than this mess. At least these posts have spurred conversation and brought some long awaited awareness to the topic.

 

[Liber.N]

 

[Liber.N]

So, TacR is not an operation, it's an ongoing 24/7 evolution/metamorphosis that is used for numerous purposes. Sure we come here to have fun playing the game but obviously it is our ONLY server to showcase The Cav to public players. Not counting youtube videos which are really just a preview, TacR is our DEMO... and our ONLY demo. We have been increasingly encouraged to pop TacR for this purpose and hopefully as our ultimate recruitment tool. And we are doing it. However, we can't showcase aviation if we don't have sufficient assets available with which to showcase it. Nor could other non-aviation units. Cause and effect: Lock down the slots and we will have people showing up not being able to play, sample or test drive our server's expansive breadth and scope. Now when it comes to "oversaturation" ... you kinda have to think- Are these players having fun doing what they want to do? Are they training? Are they learning? Are they getting stick-time? Are they test-driving our server? I can imagine trying to force people to do what they don't want to do might not be fun for them and likely would result in a pretty quick disconnect. It certainly would for me.

It really just needs to be balanced and currently it is not.

Prior slotting settings have worked just fine which is why I suggested it, but anything would likely be better than this mess. At least these posts have spurred conversation and brought some long awaited awareness to the topic.

How many slots do you need ?

 

[Sam.T]

While we're on the subject of the TacR slotting situation, can I raise that we have over 20 billeted medics in the Cav now, plus 5-6 public players who consistently run medical roles on TacR, and only 4 medic slots?

The Bravo Troop SP today really highlighted that. We had medics in Atlas slots, CLS slots, and running overflow into rifleman slots, and we didn't even have a full turnout. Having an extra four medical slots plus the 6-8 CLS slots available would make life a lot easier for us should we want to hop on and play together or run SP makeups with larger groups of medics.

 

[Mazinski.H]

So, TacR is not an operation, it's an ongoing 24/7 evolution/metamorphosis that is used for numerous purposes. Sure we come here to have fun playing the game but obviously it is our ONLY server to showcase The Cav to public players.

The idea of "showcasing the Cavalry" normally refers to showcasing Combined Arms warfare because that is what we do in operations and what we train on in section practices. It is THE THING that makes us stand out from a lot of units past the basic unit concepts of brotherhood. Combined Arms warfare is dependent on a balance between all assets involved, we can't have too much of one because it throws off the balance for others in the pile in terms of effectiveness and gameplay. Too much armor and you take work away from the infantry and aviation, too much aviation and you take work from armor and infantry, too much infantry and you take work from aviation and armor.

If you have ten ground guys running around with six airframes overhead, either that infantry isn't gonna have to much to do because aviation is clearing the field for them, or the aviation is going to be bored because the infantry want to have their fun and don't call them in for anything more than the most critical strikes when the situation on the ground is already fucked. Even worse, the infantry may resent the aviation because a lot of times they need more manpower on the ground, not another Bison overhead doing circles. This is EXACLTY what happens both in TacR and in operations with aviation saturation. Off the top of my head I can think of a number of WFW where we had an excess of airframes and people complained about this exact thing and documented it in the AAR.

However, we can't showcase aviation if we don't have sufficient assets available with which to showcase it.

Currently there are six dedicated airframe slots, one Buffalo, two Ravens, one Raider, one Hog, and one Titan. For a server that averages 15-20 players this seems more than appropriate. In fact this seems a bit heavy on the attack side actually, it should probably be two Buffalos/Bisons, two Ravens/Raiders, and two Hogs with Titan removed since we literally never use Titan for its intended purpose on the server. It should also be said that we almost never exceed six pilot slots in our official operations that we run with an average of 35-45 troopers so in terms of ratios, TacR already far exceeds those that we have in our actual operations that we are supposed to be showcasing on TacR.

Are these players having fun doing what they want to do? Are they training? Are they learning? Are they getting stick-time? Are they test-driving our server? I can imagine trying to force people to do what they don't want to do might not be fun for them and likely would result in a pretty quick disconnect. It certainly would for me.

While I was writing this I saw a little bit of text pop up in the server chat which said:

Now I can't speak for Mr. Herrc's state of mind, but if one wanted to they could assume that our friend here wanted to hop onto our server after a long day of festivities and so loaded his modpack which happened to include the Simple Single Player Cheat Menu, attempted to join, and was promptly removed by the server because, surprise surprise, we don't allow people to play with a mod called the Simple Single Player Cheat Menu. However the point here is that we already force people to do what they don't want to do. Sure this is an extreme example, but we do limit what the players can and can't do for a number of reasons. For example, we used to blacklist opfor equipment from the arsenals and some people left the server because of it, but it also reinforced the general milsim and Combined Arms aspect of the server and we gained a number of new people. It made sure that we could easily PID who is friendly and who isn't, it made resupplies a lot easier because we could pull premade crates and assume that everything in the box is compatible with the weapon systems that were in the field.

We can and should do everything we can to reinforce those aspects of our server, because when it comes to showcasing the Cav, this is what we mean. It's milsim, it's combined arms, and it's the brotherhood, and I am not sure how a flight of Buffalos slots improves or enhances our ability to showcase these things.

 

[Hamm.C]

Simply providing feedback in the feedback forum suggesting that we fix issues and optimize the current slotting situation. I see you took quite some time and thought to write all that up and I appreciate it. Hopefully, now that I was able to drum up some awareness about this problem, we will see some positive changes in the near future. If we do, I will report back on the results of any such changes, and provide further feedback. Thanks!

 

[Knights.Z]

Now, there's no way to know who did this, but this image highlights either 1 or 2 problems:

1. Someone with Zeus spawned these

The liberation mission file has a whole logistics system that we have to work through to get assets, it makes those assets valuable. If we have zeus' just coming on and spamming stuff like this then what's the point?

2. Someone wasted a whole bunch of supplies building these

Construction/Build perms are, by default, on for everyone. So anyone can join the server at 2 am and build and subsequently crash whatever they want with no repercussions, wasting the hard work of those who play Atlas 4.


I recycled all the airplanes

 

[Rosefield.M]

It seems that inactive, but undamaged drones can effect the mission file. We have been trying to capture point on the east part of the island for nearly an hour and nothing was letting us because a drone was landed square in-between a few towns on the west side confusing the mission file. So clean up after the drone toys please.

 

[Nailydud1]

Now, there's no way to know who did this, but this image highlights either 1 or 2 problems:

1. Someone with Zeus spawned these

The liberation mission file has a whole logistics system that we have to work through to get assets, it makes those assets valuable. If we have zeus' just coming on and spamming stuff like this then what's the point?

2. Someone wasted a whole bunch of supplies building these

Construction/Build perms are, by default, on for everyone. So anyone can join the server at 2 am and build and subsequently crash whatever they want with no repercussions, wasting the hard work of those who play Atlas 4.


I recycled all the airplanes

This has been an issue with some zeuses (some far more than others) that I have complained about in game for months.

 

[Rob.Y]

Now, there's no way to know who did this, but this image highlights either 1 or 2 problems:

1. Someone with Zeus spawned these

The liberation mission file has a whole logistics system that we have to work through to get assets, it makes those assets valuable. If we have zeus' just coming on and spamming stuff like this then what's the point?

2. Someone wasted a whole bunch of supplies building these

Construction/Build perms are, by default, on for everyone. So anyone can join the server at 2 am and build and subsequently crash whatever they want with no repercussions, wasting the hard work of those who play Atlas 4.


I recycled all the airplanes

Best we can do is see it and report it to your coc so the proper staff can work on a remedy and educate individuals on the importance of proper zues spawning of assets

 

[Nailydud1]

Best we can do is see it and report it to your coc so the proper staff can work on a remedy and educate individuals on the importance of proper zues spawning of assets

Who would that be for a pubby like me who does not have one of your fancy CoC's?

 

[Rob.Y]

Who would that be for a pubby like me who does not have one of your fancy CoC's?

Can report to any cav member on the server, preferably those of the highest rank and they can pass it on from their.

 

[Knights.Z]

Best we can do is see it and report it to your coc so the proper staff can work on a remedy and educate individuals on the importance of proper zues spawning of assets

I could report this to my CoC all year and they're just going to ask me 'Have you got any evidence to prove who did it?' and then when i reply no, I'm just going to get shrugged shoulders.

Realistically we have two options:

A. Catch the person doing it red handed, which would mean they would have to admit to doing it, or be the only person on the server with zeus access at the time

B. Limit or remove the ability for zeus' on Lib to spawn assets excessively

IMO option B is untenable due to official events taking place on the public server, such as MCCs and/or SPs. So really there isn't a whole bunch that can be done actively right now, so realistically the only thing we can do is alert people to the problem and either deter or catch people doing stuff like this in the future. I think that posting this here effectively accomplishes that better than if I set up a private message with 3 other people.

 

[Sutodoreh.W]

Now, there's no way to know who did this, but this image highlights either 1 or 2 problems:

1. Someone with Zeus spawned these

The liberation mission file has a whole logistics system that we have to work through to get assets, it makes those assets valuable. If we have zeus' just coming on and spamming stuff like this then what's the point?

2. Someone wasted a whole bunch of supplies building these

Construction/Build perms are, by default, on for everyone. So anyone can join the server at 2 am and build and subsequently crash whatever they want with no repercussions, wasting the hard work of those who play Atlas 4.


I recycled all the airplanes

Ah I can put this to rest, it was me who spawned them in and I just forgot to delete them. Thanks for catching it and removing them Knights.Z -- it wasn't to bypass the lib system (as you know I complain fairly regularly about this too), it was because I was running a public carrier landing lesson/demo on tuesday and thursday ahead of today's carrier operation and couldn't fit enough birds on the ship to keep up with the respawns. Zeus slots can't pilot planes so I had to spawn extras then switch back out of zeus rather than just replace them one by one. Sorry all!

 

[Sutodoreh.W]

It seems that inactive, but undamaged drones can effect the mission file. We have been trying to capture point on the east part of the island for nearly an hour and nothing was letting us because a drone was landed square in-between a few towns on the west side confusing the mission file. So clean up after the drone toys please.

Was it a Raven drone or a vanilla one? Vanilla ones count as BLUFOR AI so it wouldn't surprise me if they trigger OPFOR spawns

 

[Liber.N]

Ah I can put this to rest, it was me who spawned them in and I just forgot to delete them. Thanks for catching it and removing them Knights.Z -- it wasn't to bypass the lib system (as you know I complain fairly regularly about this too), it was because I was running a public carrier landing lesson/demo on tuesday and thursday ahead of today's carrier operation and couldn't fit enough birds on the ship to keep up with the respawns. Zeus slots can't pilot planes so I had to spawn extras then switch back out of zeus rather than just replace them one by one. Sorry all!

 

[Rosefield.M]

Was it a Raven drone or a vanilla one? Vanilla ones count as BLUFOR AI so it wouldn't surprise me if they trigger OPFOR spawns

No clue just saw its icon over there

 

[Maco.D]

When the prairie fire CDLC came out it was a big hit for a while as we ran it on Tac 1 for 2-3 months If i remember. It had a large update come out today with a new map and alot of new content. The mike force game mode has been made open to allow it to be used from what I understand non praire fire modset to quote

"We're also making Mike Force and its supporting library Paradigm open source. People will be free to modify and extend Mike Force for their own communities, and contribute their own changes to the base mission. We're excited to see what everyone comes up with, and to continue to develop the mission with more input from the community."

Any chance we could reopen tac 1 for a month or so with the update we might be able to use it to get a boost in recruitment as well

 

[Lindsay.A]

When the prairie fire CDLC came out it was a big hit for a while as we ran it on Tac 1 for 2-3 months If i remember. It had a large update come out today with a new map and alot of new content. The mike force game mode has been made open to allow it to be used from what I understand non praire fire modset to quote

"We're also making Mike Force and its supporting library Paradigm open source. People will be free to modify and extend Mike Force for their own communities, and contribute their own changes to the base mission. We're excited to see what everyone comes up with, and to continue to develop the mission with more input from the community."

Any chance we could reopen tac 1 for a month or so with the update we might be able to use it to get a boost in recruitment as well

Agreed. Aviation especially Rotary would benefit from another run at Prairie Fire. Not sure we can fill two servers in the summer but might be worth a shot for a month?